Hacker News
I'm Getting a Whiff of Iain Banks' Culture
Matl
|next
[-]
So not sure I buy the analogy.
jrowen
|root
|parent
[-]
Matl
|root
|parent
[-]
But he does perfectly demonstrate that you can't have operational efficiency if you're ignorant about your enemies because you're being advised by religious fanatics, if your goals are constantly shifting and your motives are purely selfish.
jrowen
|root
|parent
[-]
Idk if I agree with this. First off, your initial verbiage is distinctly Trumpian. Second, I think Trump, like Hitler, activates latent sentiments that are largely kept at bay with "normal" post-WWII world leader politics. I think it's anomalous and once we get out of it things will normalize.
But really, my main point was that the politics and the "whys" of these decisions (capture Maduro, bomb Iran) are outside the scope of the article. It assumes that the decisions have been made and is looking only at the impact of specific technology on the operational outcomes.
It seems like a lot of the commenters are responding as if the article is making the point that "the US is like the Culture" but it's much more narrow and specific than that.
disgruntledphd2
|root
|parent
|next
[-]
That being said, it's possible that AI is helping here.
Mind you, given the sycophancy of current models, it's also possible that commanders are making worse decisions based on the results of these AI outputs.
Finally, if the US manage to get what they want without completely destroying the balance of power in the Middle East or sending oil to 150 a barrel, then I'd be much more likely to accept the authors speculation.
jrowen
|root
|parent
[-]
Matl
|root
|parent
|previous
[-]
Right, however that narrow point of essentially (overwhelming) technological superiority and 'efficiency' can be made using a very large number of science fiction. The Culture explores specific themes that make it what it is. If you completely dismiss them, I am not sure you are left with even a whiff of Iain Banks' Culture.
And to be clear, the point I am specifically making is that a lot of what the US is currently doing is not exactly rational, or even a supper efficient way to achieve their stated goals and a lot of it seems to be made up as they go along.
That does not feel like The Culture to me.
kaashif
|next
|previous
[-]
I could not disagree with this more.
Just the perfect micro part means that computers have a far higher ceiling than humans.
No, it is not possible in theory for humans to have perfect micro with thousands of APM!
We're talking about hundred unit zergling swarms perfectly dodging tank shells. Hundreds of APM at multiple locations on the map. Perfect timing and placement for every order.
This is like saying an aimbot wouldn't make a top CS pro much better.
snovv_crash
|root
|parent
|next
[-]
L_226
|root
|parent
|next
|previous
[-]
Exactly the reference I was thinking of https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKVFZ28ybQs
jrowen
|root
|parent
|previous
[-]
OkayPhysicist
|next
|previous
[-]
Force projection, targeted aerial strikes, intelligence gathering, and a nuclear deterrent play to the US miltary's strengths. Convincing the people who we just whacked the leaders of to like us? Not at all. The US doesn't have the political will to commit the monstrous acts required to stomp out an insurgency, and we, as the big bad empire on the global stage, can't help but inspire insurgents.
If you look at the boondoggles that the US has gotten itself into post Korea, they typically follow a pattern of "we show up, complete the key objectives in the first couple of days, and then spend years occupying territory while trying to root out an insurgency, creating new insurgents at least as fast as we neutralize them, then eventually limp away with our tail between our legs."
Lately, we've been just doing the first part. Which is the part we've been good at for ages. No need to blame AI, it's just that we aren't / haven't gotten around to doing the part we suck at.
arethuza
|next
|previous
[-]
tao_oat
|next
|previous
[-]
The US has nearly always been successful in terms of conventional firepower and individual operations. E.g. in 2003 the US overthrew Saddam's government in a matter of weeks. The US won most battles in Vietnam. That doesn't change the fact that the strategic outcomes and long-term track record are poor. Trying to draw a link to AI or the current state of the US military feels flimsy.
Anyway, the recurring Big Question throughout the Culture series is "how should a highly progressive, developed, and egalitarian society act when it meets others who are not?". The US is sliding further and further from that ideal, and you can argue whether it was ever close.
flowerbreeze
|next
|previous
[-]
alistairSH
|next
|previous
[-]
recursivedoubts
|next
|previous
[-]
In my experience this is the big difference with AI vs humans. It's not superhuman intelligence (although it does have a massive working memory) but rather the ability to just grind on anything you throw at it, long past the point when any reasonable human would have taken a break or given up.
"It can kind of be be bargained with. It can kind of be reasoned with. It doesn't feel pity, or remorse, or fear but it will fake them! And it absolutely will not stop, ever, until you are absolutely right!"
MrOrelliOReilly
|next
|previous
[-]
EDIT: I see this post has been flagged. Why? I understand it’s political but it seems very much within the site’s ethos. I didn’t get the impression it was AI-writing either.
rimeice
|next
|previous
[-]
[1] - https://www.darioamodei.com/essay/machines-of-loving-grace#5...
harperlee
|next
|previous
[-]
soupfordummies
|next
|previous
[-]
"Hey claude, tell me how the US can abduct Maduro. Your response should include all details regarding times, local places as well as blah blah blah"
jrowen
|root
|parent
|next
[-]
One area is "micromanagement." Hundreds of individual units moving and acting independently is very difficult for one human general to track, let alone react and give orders to quickly. Think more about rapid data analysis and surfacing supporting information than it being the singular mastermind behind the operation.
As the article says, it's not a huge quantum leap where it just obliterates everything. It's about just being a little bit smarter, a little bit faster, having that little edge that tips everything in their favor.
Matl
|root
|parent
|previous
[-]
yacin
|next
|previous
[-]
skybrian
|next
|previous
[-]
The US being able to engage in a very one-sided air war is not surprising. The Gulf War went similarly well and so did the 2003 invasion of Iraq, at first.
I think it’s surprising that attempting to capture or kill a foreign leader actually worked. But I’m not sure if US presidents other than Trump would have tried? Trump has a lot of “you can just do things” energy due to being largely unconstrained by legal or moral considerations, or larger strategic concerns.
Israeli intelligence being able to so thoroughly hack the devices of their enemies clearly has a lot to do with this. What happened to Hezbollah was surprising.
automatic6131
|next
|previous
[-]
Completely dry of any data, based on vibes and a vague whiff that maybe a chatbot did all the hard work done by hardworking spooks.
Effective operations have happened just like this long before chatgpt launched.
fsloth
|root
|parent
|next
[-]
A_D_E_P_T
|root
|parent
|next
|previous
[-]
timdiggerm
|root
|parent
|previous
[-]
There is no measurement of efficacy here. It feels like these things are working better because the US military is now doing big public things, but that is not necessarily a good change over not-doing-big-public-things.
amenhotep
|root
|parent
[-]
zer00eyz
|next
|previous
[-]
This is the JOB of the military... and it has been for a long time. I would think there is even modern version of "war plan red" (see: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_Plan_Red ) somewhere.
keybored
|next
|previous
[-]
Today it’s how AI is a superpower for the already by-far the most powerful military in the world. Okay sure why not.
In the case of Maduro was that an amazing feat? Massacring the whole bodyguard entourage? Capturing a head of state who might have been a willing accomplice?
How does this square with bombing civilian targets in Iran? Another superhuman stalker-micro move?
pavlov
|next
|previous
[-]
Let's see how many days until something else tops it.
sp1nningaway
|root
|parent
[-]
I can commiserate with this person cooking up a rant based on a faulty initial premise but it's a doozy. Kidnapping heads of state and indiscriminate bombing campaigns with massive collateral damage certainly don't fit my conception of "acting powerful."
TimorousBestie
|next
|previous
[-]
This is either a misreading of the Culture (which for all its fictional foibles is not a federation of nation-states), a misunderstanding of what the European Union is, or both.